General Discussion

General DiscussionWhats the deal with OD?

Whats the deal with OD? in General Discussion
J-Man

    I know I just had 4 games where I absolutely crushed it as OD. But I feel like he's not the same in higher brackets. Is it because wind is a super popular pick for mid right now or he just gets ass blasted by other mids?

    And I know my last game was vs an ogre mid, a pos 1 CM and a Pos 5 riki but thats beside the point

    Kabir singh's bo0ster

      Windranger is countered by OD, hes a good hero to learn but Aghs build is much better then right click cause it makes him less voulnerable and gives him a lot of catch and setup.

      ET

        His highest winrate across all brackets is sub-2K, where he's 46.47%, and it just progressively drops until divine/immortal where it's a 40.45% winrate. Looking at item choices and talent choices, he's well over 50% winrate when he gets certain "big items" or past lvl 20, though that data might be skewed by other factors.
        Here's my simple hypethesis:
        he's pretty weak in laning stage, basically draws or loses most 1v1s right now barring some big skill gap between the OD and enemy mid, or some rune luck and misplay.
        then shit midgame. His ult requires him to get some hits and astrals off before it becomes that powerful nuke hammer, and by then most players would have the sense to spread out.
        He's one of the stronger lategame carries, but he takes forever to get there because his flashfarm is really bad.

        J-Man

          Well right now I seem to be winning with him. I will keep using him for the moment till I start getting stomped out

          Arian

            od sucks at all stages of the game and his aghs is shit also just dont pick od lol

            Bambooni

              Some times you get winning streak 3-5 games max on a certain hero then you lose a game or two and its suddenly bad. Happened a lot of times to me on certain heroes.

              3
              3

                OD need too much farm as a mid hero

                J-Man

                  Better to have a streak of 3 to 5 games then quit on the 1 or 2 loses. That way you still always end up in the green.

                  Besides at my skill level. I can get away with just force staff and go on a kill spree level rampage.

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                  Blood Prince.

                    I don't see bkb on the enemy heroes except for the first game. There's your answer

                    J-Man

                      I agree with that statement. However in archon people are deftly allergic to BKB. Or in the rare case, rush it vs a physical damage team.

                      Shoukyaku

                        od is basically bad at literally everything

                        farms slower, loses lane, doesnt fight or rotate well, doesnt pressure towers, cant take rosh, doesnt have a reliable disable, isnt tanky or slippery/mobile, this hero literally doesnt do a single thing well in the game.

                        Kabir singh's bo0ster

                          @Shoukyaku

                          He does a few things well. 1. massive magic/pure damage output 2. very long range catch/save/setup iirc 1000 range he can remove 2 heroes from a fight, great against Void, Pudge, SF etc you simply cannot get your spells off vs an early Aghs OD in teamfights. 3. Good against high EHP/low int heroes, Timber, Tide, Slark, Morph, Meepo, your 30 armor means shit if u get blasted with 500 pure dmg per hit and billion damage from his ulti. OD's lane is not bad at all if you are daddy at getting the most out of astral some melee heroes will routinely lose 2 creeps from OD per wave while getting nuked to shit and him securing everything, depends on the matchup.

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                          Shoukyaku

                            he isnt good vs those heroes because p much everyone he is supposed to be good against just abuses his other gigantic glaring weaknesses. how can u possibly expect a hero who needs items to scale but cant fight early or farm early to be good lmfao. astral lvl 1-2 is a 300/350 cast range ability on a 24/20 second cd thats actually just not good enough against most heroes especially when he isnt even fast enough to close the distance on other mid heroes. even if he "wins" the lane he literally can't do anything else.

                            Kabir singh's bo0ster

                              What do you mean he can't do anything else, you push the wave, farm jungle, get 14-16 min Aghs and go fight, he has insane damage output and setup its impossible to fight into OD with good timings.

                              Kabir singh's bo0ster

                                5652878758, 5652462051 Watch the complete and utter rape of fast Aghs OD in good game u literally cannot do anything in figts. You are underestimating this hero for real very strong hero situationally.

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                                Shoukyaku

                                  u farm jungle slower than any contemporary and cant contribute until min 15 as a mid? you cant pressure tower, or gank sidelanes or flash farm = useless hero

                                  you are basically forced to hope that all the negative space youre creating (or the space youre consuming from your teammates) is payed back by them being able to do everything normal mids can do but doing it for you. do you seriously think 14-16 minutes of being dead on the map is worth having an od with aghs lmfao, meanwhile the enemy ember who you beat in lane just ganked sidelanes for 10 minutes and has 7 kills or the enemy ta has blink deso and is abt to take roshan or the enemy dk/pugna is taking all ur t1 towers, and what are you doing, desperately trying to farm small and medium camps, at a mediocre pace hoping that youre good lategame wtih items can make up for you being an immobile turret with no inherent disable or tankiness. you have to buy like 4-5 items to make up for all your weaknesses and by that point ur down 6 towers and a rosh maybe 2 rosh's and ur crying like the beta shit hero you are.

                                  Kabir singh's bo0ster

                                    Your understanding of the hero and especially the game is as would be expected from your MMR, very strong opinions and theory crafting things in over exaggerated ways that don't really fly in an actual game.

                                    Apipe

                                      I still have nightmare of OD + Omniknight combo :charm_rage:

                                      Shoukyaku

                                        ok then why does od have a 40% winrate xd

                                        http://dota2protracker.com/hero/Outworld%20Devourer

                                        care to explain?

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                                        Apipe

                                          Hey, Dota Pro and Dota Pubs are in different world in term of win rate.

                                          Meganesta

                                            i dont think this bero only work with item.
                                            As long as your W can help to set up stun etc

                                            Blood Prince.

                                              Did your head hit somewhere @shoukyaku? It shows 50% winrate and even in dotabuff it shows OD has 48%winrate, what is this 40% you're talking about?

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                                              Shoukyaku

                                                its 45%

                                                of course pros and pubs are different lmao, but why on earth would u judge the game from how ur average legend/archon player plays?

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                                                Blood Prince.

                                                  Now it's 45%? What happened to 40%?

                                                  Apipe

                                                    Because we will always live on earth that called pubs :axe_laugh:

                                                    Fathomorg

                                                      Bear in mind that 45% average does not translate to 0% in practice, and your sample size is 4 matches. If you play 30+ matches of OD with average proficiency, it is expected that you will likely have approximately a 45% winrate.

                                                      Shoukyaku

                                                        now the winrate is 43, u gonna actually make a point abt what i said or just point out minor number discrepancies

                                                        J-Man

                                                          Damn that got spicy real fast.

                                                          ET

                                                            I was gonna make a case about winning on bad heroes with my recent Leshrac stomp, but apparently his winrate is above 50% now and IDK what buffs he took to make this possible

                                                            Shoukyaku

                                                              they buffed his ult radius last patch iirc

                                                              Von Darkmoor

                                                                Well 150 is melee range and Harbs nuke is 300 range so infact he CANT cast it without getting punished by a melee hero.....

                                                                I want old harb back atleast then you won the lane.

                                                                Im fairly confident My jungle sniperu and My mask of madness basher pudge would win vs a harb.

                                                                Shoukyaku

                                                                  of course he can use it on a melee hero if they jsut stood afk, but anyone can drag creeps or kite around 300 range to make it hard to use, not like you will never get astralled but its kind of an awful spell

                                                                  Kabir singh's bo0ster

                                                                    If u drag creeps as a melee u basically said goodbye to your ranged creep, as OD will pull aggro himself, posture around your ranged, astral if u contest, deny his secure yours ez clap

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