General Discussion

General Discussion7.07 Trends

7.07 Trends in General Discussion
Dire Wolf

    Only a day but interesting to see a few hero win rates spike a ton.

    Medusa and beastmaster both up 10% to 56% and 53%. Their pick rate is pretty stable, still low around 5%.

    The medusa one I saw coming. People saying the new split shot is bad cus you can't control lane are being short sighted. What the new split shot does is let medusa still farm but also doesn't totally neuter her dmg early game by 20%. And they buffed her talents a ton, before her first two you could get 15 dmg and 20 attack speed bumped up to 25 dmg and 30 speed. Her mana bonus talent at 20 got bumped from 600 to 800. And her level 25 is actually useful now. Split shot acquisition range helps a lot too so dragon lance is actually useful. And diffusal nerfed. It's still a good medusa counter but it's a weaker item in general now so it might disuade non core diffusal heroes from building it. Plus new items, perhaps people are experimenting with all the new stuff and not buying diffusal as much.

    BM just got huge buffs all around. We'll see if he levels off but he seems solid right now, extra creep, extra move speed on his ult. Just good buffs.

    AM is the next guy who jumped a ton, 8% to 57.8%. That's ridiciulous and I hope not sustainable since he's one of the most fucking annoying heroes to play vs. Many are complaining about his level 25 spell shield talent but I think all you really need to look at is battlefury got buffed. 400g less means you can get it like a minute earlier.

    That's it for more than 5% jumps though tinker, storm, meepo, OD, TB and razor all jumped around 4-5%. Most of these went from being bad sub 50% win rates to right around 50% though so not as huge of jumps.

    Stone Cold Steve Austin

      Morph -10%.
      But there's nothing "interesting" in that, he basically has no ulti right now.

      Dire Wolf

        On the flip side tiny and morphling are the heroes nerfed hardest, dropping 7% and 9%.

        Tiny I appreciate them trying to make aghs not core on a hero who sucks at farming, but removing all of his armor just makes him paper. I don't care how much hp he has if he gets zero armor, his ehp is less than int heroes. And he's not a hero who can just farm a shit ton of armor items since he needs blink or shadowblade to be truly effective.

        All along every buff tiny thread I always said just give him like 2 more base armor and call it a day but they did the opposite.

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        Riguma Borusu

          what's the point of making aghs non mandatory when AC is now mandatory

          Dire Wolf

            If I ever play tiny, and not planning on it since he sucks, but I'm probably going armlet and vlads first two items for 13 armor when active and lifesteal to sustain the armlet drain. Then rush AC. Sucks but idk how else you can play him, he's purely right clicker now I think.

            Cheap Laugh Guy

              Razor's much fun to play
              And actually a decent pick now

              Stone Cold Steve Austin

                He's in a very dire position right now, he needs at least +20 armor not to be a big walking physical burst target, and that's a lot of unnecessary items.

                CMNT

                  I didn't see people talking about Centaur, the hero is too OP right now with only vanguard and heart he is unkillable. He could tank at the frontline even tower hit Cent like no damage at all.

                  The new Strength calculations and some stuff are pretty huge for this hero.

                  Väinämöinen

                    uhm a cent with vanguard and heart could tank towers even before this patch, even destroy them

                    Xignum

                      I'm not sure how it is but is am having an issue of getting a demon edge instead of getting a claymore like before?like before you get some damage in the middle but now you have to go straight for demon edge.

                      Dire Wolf

                        Trying to think of other tiny options, maybe vanguard? Dmg block is before armor reductions. If you build it into crimson guard you get armor on it too. Kind of expensive option though, and abyssal tiny sounds godawful since he attacks super slow.

                        Blade mail may be a really good option. If you have no armor just discourage people from hitting you. But at the same time, if agility hero with double your armor has lifesteal you'll die way before they do.

                        Solar crest/medallion are ok but you won't be able to use the active. Still evasion is really good if you have no armor, stats on crest aren't that bad for the price.

                        Urn of shadows is negligible amount but spirit vessel is pretty cool.

                        CMNT

                          @Unhealable damage
                          I'm an Offlane Cent spammer but I could see the huge change in his arsenal when I play him lately considering his talent, the 200+ to his W nuke, the +15% Damage return and the new stats system that favor his huge strength gain.

                          The only problem as usual is his low mana pool and removing that +3 mana regen talent is huge nerf.

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                          Stone Cold Steve Austin

                            Also, they really need to do something with some mana regen talents (Omni knight +6 mana reg will probably give him around +18 at that stage, but even Bristle can get a stable +5ish out of his +2 mana reg talent) and FUCKING BLOODSTONE giving flat mana regen still.
                            t. being dumpstered by Storm Spirit who has 178 mana regen/sec.

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                            Odinn21

                              When I read the patch notes I thought AM, CK, DK, Gyrocopter, Juggernaut, Luna, Medusa, SF and TB were buffed among the carries. And apparently I was right.
                              AM; +8.5% winrate increase.
                              CK; +2.8% (Keep in mind, he already had a huge winrate. Currently he's standing at door of 60%.)
                              DK; +4.3%
                              Gyro; +2.8%
                              Jugg; +3.6%
                              Luna; +3.2%
                              Medusa; +9.6%
                              SF; +2.7%
                              TB; +3.4%

                              I think AM is broken at the moment. The hero needs to be nerfed. His winrate when he's lvl25 is nearly 70% and that 30% spell shield talent needs to be nerfed or removed. I mean the hardest late game carries even sit around 65% winrate when they are lvl25. AM is just too much. Even bringing back the previous Fury would do it.

                              A̶𝖘𝖍𝖊𝖘

                                If you nerf green cancer heros this is bound to happen!!

                                Jung

                                  for @Keyser Soze
                                  Do you have a hard time farming during your offlane phase right now with the current picks with centaur?
                                  I used to play him pretty often as well but during the previous patch with trilanes being so abundant, I found it more difficult to get to the hood + blink combo in a sufficient time. (even with jungle)
                                  In this patch, I think 2-1-2 heavy roam was much more common so I can see centaur being given more room, but has it been easier for you this patch to get the big items early?

                                  Dire Wolf

                                    What's funny is all these heroes are experiencing a surge in win rates. Well dota 2 win rate is zero sum- add up all the hero win rates x pick rates and it has to end up at 50% cus one side always wins while other side loses. If you look at trends a couple heroes are losing a lot, but most are just gaining win rate. Where did it come from?

                                    The fucking new heroes lol, pangolier is 45% pick rate, 36% win rate. Dark willow is 46% picked, 46% win rate. They are literally feeding wins to every other hero their is.

                                    Zus

                                      Nullifier is the most op shit i have ever seen

                                      Zus

                                        buy silence buy nullifier and solo kill every hero on the map, how is this ever gonna be justified being in the game?

                                        TheMaverick427

                                          The morph win rate drop is partially due to the strength gain being moved to the F key buy default and the agility gain being moved to D (where the strength gain was). I was messing around in demo mode and still died several times because everytime I wanted to shift to strength I'd hit D out of habit, go full agility and die before I realised I screwed up. Can almost guarantee that this is also happening in game a lot.

                                          Tribo

                                            Change the options then?
                                            CK and Cent are too OP